CFD Online Logo CFD Online URL
www.cfd-online.com
[Sponsors]
Home > Forums > General Forums > Main CFD Forum

False time step factors

Register Blogs Community New Posts Updated Threads Search

Like Tree2Likes
  • 2 Post By Rami

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old   May 31, 2002, 18:14
Default False time step factors
  #1
Jesper Laursen
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Hi everybody!

I am using false time step factors for calculating unsteady 3D multi-fluid flow in a wwtp aeration tank. I am using false time step factors to avoid numerical instability. My problem is that I canīt find any good definition of what false time steps exactly do, or how it works. The CFX 4.4 manual doesn't give any usefull information on that point. Can anyone give me a thorough description of how it works? -Or do anybody know any good articles on the subject? Are there any drawbacks in using false time step factors in the problem described above?

Thanks in advance Jesper, a student from Denmark.
  Reply With Quote

Old   June 1, 2002, 03:35
Default Re: False time step factors
  #2
Adarsh
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
hello Jesper my work is somewhat similar to urs.... i think this cud be useful for u A.Jameson -AIAA paper -1991-"time dependent calculations.....".. he also uses false time stepping for unsteady flows .. though i am still to get what exactly he does.. still we can discuss . you can choose to write to me at chugh@aero.iisc.ernet.in personally.

regards, Adarsh
  Reply With Quote

Old   June 2, 2002, 04:04
Default Re: False time step factors
  #3
Rami
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Hi Jesper,

False time steps is a numerical relaxation technique used to stabilize the solution. It does so by adding a pseudo-transient term to the solved conservation equation, and then advances the iterative process by time increments.

The time increment size is usually based on the CFL (Courant-Friedrichs-Levy) stability condition. This condition varies from one scheme to another. A rough estimate would be dt < min{(cell size)/velocity} over the entire grid. However, implicit schemes may usually maintain stability with much larger (x5 or so) steps.

This type of process is usually applied for steady problems in which the time-stepping is merely used as intermetiate iteration, therefore the time steps may be chosen to satisfy the CFL condition locally, i.e., advancing the solution at each computational grid using a different false-time-step, which is calculated based on the cell size and velocity, rather than the minimal value of the whole grid. This is in contrast to solution of transient problems, where the solution should be advanced using a uniform step, and it is therefore the minimal value over the entire grid (hence the term "false").

The drawback of the method is related to the stabilty limit: on certain occasions many steps are required to obtain convergence.

Any book on CFD should explain this method in more detail, e.g.,

Anderson, Tannehill and Pletcher, Computational Fluid Mechanics & Heat Transfer, McGraw Hill.

I hope this helps.
linyanx and RafeWang like this.
  Reply With Quote

Old   June 4, 2002, 05:11
Default Re: False time step factors
  #4
adarsh
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
hello rami

you have given an eloquent description of false time steps.. which is done for faster convergence .. but if we want to obtain the time accurate solutuion then time steps must be equal(as you have said) .. is false time stepping still apllicable .. if yes, i what manner. becos the minimum time step then wud be determined by lowest CFL ...

Jameson has done some false time stepping for time accurate solutions..in his work (aiaa-1991) ..where he runs one additional pseudo loop for each time step to obtain convergence .. it will be kind of you to highlight something more on this topic .. also suggest me some other book or paper.. the book by tennihill and pletcher is not availbale here at my institute.. thanks in advance regards, adarsh

  Reply With Quote

Old   June 4, 2002, 05:35
Default Re: False time step factors
  #5
Rami
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Dear Adarsh,

I agree with you that when a time-accurate (i.e., transient) solution is sought you should advance the solution with the same time step throughout the grid (unless you use some time-interploation, which seems to be complex approach to me). Therefore, the minimal time-step (as determined by the CFL criterion) should be applied. In that case, the term "false" seems inappropriate to me, as this is physically meaningful time incrementing.

I cannot recommend off-hand any other book other than Anderson et al, but I assume you will find it in any CFD textbook (e.g., Hirsch).
  Reply With Quote

Reply


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Multiple floating objects CKH OpenFOAM Running, Solving & CFD 14 February 20, 2019 10:08
Velocity blows up suddenly after 30,000+ iterations lordvon OpenFOAM Running, Solving & CFD 15 October 19, 2015 14:52
Upgraded from Karmic Koala 9.10 to Lucid Lynx10.04.3 bookie56 OpenFOAM Installation 8 August 13, 2011 05:03
Time step in transient simulation shib FLUENT 0 June 17, 2010 14:07
Convergence moving mesh lr103476 OpenFOAM Running, Solving & CFD 30 November 19, 2007 15:09


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:07.