CFD Online Logo CFD Online URL
www.cfd-online.com
[Sponsors]
Home > Forums > Software User Forums > ANSYS > CFX

Wingtip vortex dies out very soon

Register Blogs Community New Posts Updated Threads Search

Like Tree5Likes
  • 2 Post By ghorrocks
  • 2 Post By ghorrocks
  • 1 Post By ghorrocks

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old   March 6, 2021, 04:50
Default Wingtip vortex dies out very soon
  #1
New Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2021
Posts: 3
Rep Power: 5
alex_k1997 is on a distinguished road
I am new to ANSYS CFX and I am trying to simulate the wingtip vortex downstream a NACA0015 wing. However, the magnitude of the vorticity downstream the wing is significantly lower than the experimental data I am trying to validate against (I compare normalised vorticity ωc/U). I am using steady state and I have tried different turbulence models without any big difference in the results. How can I ensure that the magnitude of the vorticity is maintained downstream the wing?
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Screenshot 2021-02-16 at 3.03.24 PM.jpg (49.2 KB, 17 views)
File Type: jpg Screenshot 2021-02-10 at 12.25.20 PM.jpg (57.9 KB, 16 views)
alex_k1997 is offline   Reply With Quote

Old   March 6, 2021, 05:21
Default
  #2
Super Moderator
 
Glenn Horrocks
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 17,869
Rep Power: 144
ghorrocks is just really niceghorrocks is just really niceghorrocks is just really niceghorrocks is just really nice
Have you done a validation and verification? There is a lot to check (see FAQ https://www.cfd-online.com/Wiki/Ansy..._inaccurate.3F), but the big ones are to ensure your mesh is fine enough and convergence criteria tight enough.

Also make sure you consider numerical issues: dissipative advection scheme like upwinding will cause this sort of problem. I would set it to second order advection (Use Hybrid differencing with a blend factor of 1.0), or maybe use QUICK or other more sophisticated schemes.

Also look at your turbulence models. Many 2-eqn turbulence models over damp these sort of vorticies. Look at the curvature correction model for SST, and also consider RSM models.
aero_head and alex_k1997 like this.
__________________
Note: I do not answer CFD questions by PM. CFD questions should be posted on the forum.
ghorrocks is offline   Reply With Quote

Old   March 6, 2021, 09:54
Default
  #3
New Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2021
Posts: 3
Rep Power: 5
alex_k1997 is on a distinguished road
I have read some things about vorticity confinement. Is there a chance that I need to use something like this and if yes how can I implement this in CFX?
alex_k1997 is offline   Reply With Quote

Old   March 6, 2021, 17:03
Default
  #4
Senior Member
 
Kira
Join Date: Nov 2020
Location: Canada
Posts: 435
Rep Power: 9
aero_head is on a distinguished road
Hello,

As ghorrocks mentions, you need to consider damping for these types of problems.

Other than that, looks like vorticity confinement would work. I found a paper goes over a scenario like yours: https://www.researchgate.net/publica...rotating_blade. In FLUENT, you can implement a UDF (user defined function) and specify a confinement parameter.

Here is another paper that covers more of the theory of confinement: https://www.researchgate.net/publica...ty_Confinement
aero_head is offline   Reply With Quote

Old   March 7, 2021, 18:06
Default
  #5
Super Moderator
 
Glenn Horrocks
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 17,869
Rep Power: 144
ghorrocks is just really niceghorrocks is just really niceghorrocks is just really niceghorrocks is just really nice
I just looked up Vorticity Confinement on Wikipedia - it appears to be a special CFD approach designed for modelling flows with lots of vorticity. This approach may be useful in your case - but you won't be doing it in CFX. This sounds like something you will need to write your own CFD code for.

But CFX is quite capable of accurately predicting your flow. You just need to do the validation and verification stuff I described in my previous post.
aero_head and alex_k1997 like this.
__________________
Note: I do not answer CFD questions by PM. CFD questions should be posted on the forum.
ghorrocks is offline   Reply With Quote

Old   March 8, 2021, 03:53
Default
  #6
New Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2021
Posts: 3
Rep Power: 5
alex_k1997 is on a distinguished road
I have done a mesh independence study and my mesh gives the same results with meshes of 12million cells up to 50million. Here I attach a screen shot of my Vorticity monitor points. Point 1 is at the wingtip x/c = 0 and monitor point 2 at exactly 1 chord downstream (Screenshot 1).

I have tried RSM with no difference in the results. However, I still don't understand how to use curvature correction. What production correction value do I need to use? (Screenshot 2)

Also, I use an inlet normal velocity of 7.85m/s with air at 15degrees and my wing chord is 0.2m. Therefore my Reynolds number is about 10^5. However, in the solver is says that my Global length is 2 and indicates a Reynolds number of 10^6 (Screenshot 3). Why is this happening and does this Reynolds number affects my results?

Screenshot 2021-02-20 at 6.58.53 PM.jpg

Screenshot 2021-03-08 at 9.43.19 AM.jpg

Screenshot 2021-03-08 at 9.48.23 AM.png
alex_k1997 is offline   Reply With Quote

Old   March 8, 2021, 07:05
Default
  #7
Super Moderator
 
Glenn Horrocks
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 17,869
Rep Power: 144
ghorrocks is just really niceghorrocks is just really niceghorrocks is just really niceghorrocks is just really nice
I cannot see your mesh sensitivity results. A factor of 4 difference is a bit small, a factor of 8 to 10 is more normal. Also have a look at the grid convergence index mentioned in the FAQ.

You have not tried second order differencing as I recommended in my first post.

Strange that RSM was similar.

Read the documentation on curvature correction. Just leave it at defaults unless you have a good reason to do otherwise.

The solver calculates the global length as the cube root of the volume and uses that to calculate the Reynolds Number. It does not represent the airfoil Reynolds Number like you have calculated, it is global averaged Reynolds number to just give a general idea about what regime the simulation is in. Do not confuse this global Reynolds Number with a specific application Reynolds Number, like your airfoil.
aero_head likes this.
__________________
Note: I do not answer CFD questions by PM. CFD questions should be posted on the forum.
ghorrocks is offline   Reply With Quote

Reply

Tags
#turbulence, #vortex, #vorticity, #wingtip


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Wingtip vortex OpenFoam. Error solving with simpleFoam luram94 OpenFOAM Running, Solving & CFD 1 October 19, 2018 12:53
Presenation of vortex strength and velocity concept? fruitkiwi Main CFD Forum 0 September 26, 2012 23:08
vortex cause pressure gradient or pressure gradient induce vortex? fruitkiwi Main CFD Forum 4 June 12, 2012 02:12
[CFD-Post] Help showing wingtip vortex siw CFX 1 May 13, 2011 11:06
wingtip vortex Rooney Siemens 2 January 9, 2009 08:58


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 08:42.