CFD Online Logo CFD Online URL
www.cfd-online.com
[Sponsors]
Home > Forums > General Forums > Main CFD Forum

Question from a non-Fluid person

Register Blogs Community New Posts Updated Threads Search

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old   September 1, 1998, 17:22
Default Question from a non-Fluid person
  #1
ozzy
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Hello all,

My friends at work and I debated on a simple flow phenomena, and since non of us have backgrounds in Fluids, I decided to post it at this site.

Here is a simple question for all you fluid dynamics gurus:

I observed the shape of free falling fluids. If the fluid has not reached very high velocities, it is forming a conical shape. (just imagine the shape of the water jet coming out of a faucet, or imagine honey being poured from a spoon).

My explaination of this shape is follows: Because the flow is faster at the bottom, area of flow must be decreasing because flow must be constant. In other words, volume per time must be constant.

On the other hand, their argument is that, the shape has to be conical because of the surface tension. They say that the wide opening of the faucet overcomes surface tension first, and then gradually area decreases.

I appreciate any answers on this simple question,

Thanks everyone,

  Reply With Quote

Old   September 2, 1998, 04:41
Default Re: Question from a non-Fluid person
  #2
Jonas Larsson
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Your explanation is of course correct, at least as long as the free-falling water-jet doesn't break up. Mass-conservation demands that the area decreases as the jet accelerates due to gravity. Surface tension might play a role for very thin jets, but for real-life examples like the faucet it is surely negligible.

To convince your colleges you could turn their reasoning around - they must agree that mass conservation demands a smaller jet-area as the jet accelerates, then what they are saying is that it is the surface tension which accelerates the jet and not the gravity - That sounds a bit strange and might convince them about the primary cause of this effect.
  Reply With Quote

Old   September 2, 1998, 11:16
Default Re: Question from a non-Fluid person
  #3
John C. Chien
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
It's really a very interesting subject. I think, under certain conditions, the properties of the fluid such as the viscosity and surface tension, and the flow rate ( velocity) probably will affect the shape of the fluid column. When the viscosity and the surface tension are very high, and the velocity very low, The effect due to the gravitational force maybe less important. And when the surface instability sets in, the shape may become sausage like. Indeed a very interesting jet and spray problem.
  Reply With Quote

Old   September 2, 1998, 12:23
Default Re: Question from a non-Fluid person
  #4
Jonas Larsson
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
For the applications in question here (low-velocity flow from a faucet and honey-flow from a spoon) I think that you can safely neglect surface tension effects. Don't you agree?
  Reply With Quote

Old   September 2, 1998, 12:45
Default Re: Question from a non-Fluid person
  #5
John C. Chien
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Yes, I agree with you that in these two cases the free falling motion of the liquid in the gravitational field will accelerate the speed of the liquid. So, in order to satisfy the continuity equation, the flow area has to decrease so that ( rho * U(y) * area(y) ) remains constant. I was simply trying to point out another door related to the surface tension of liquid. I would think, it's an important subject in space station environment.
  Reply With Quote

Old   September 2, 1998, 15:55
Default Re: Question from a non-Fluid person
  #6
ozzy
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Gentleman,

As Jonas stated, my question was for laminar flow, with low velocity and/or high viscosity.

Thank you for your responses!
  Reply With Quote

Old   September 4, 1998, 05:09
Default Re: Question from a non-Fluid person
  #7
Chun-Hao Teng
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
I agree with Jonas Larsson and John C. Chien that the gravatational force was the main reason. There are several papers related to this problem. However, there are lots of things playing inside this system. In a paper written by SP Lin on Physics of fluid in 97 or 98, several pictures of jet flow been taken under different parameters. The pictures show that under micro gravity that the diameter of the jet remains the same.
  Reply With Quote

Reply


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Question on heat tranfer from an obstacle into fluid ekh95 FLOW-3D 0 June 3, 2009 19:09
Power law fluid question Wesley OpenFOAM Running, Solving & CFD 0 April 3, 2009 17:21
Intl Conf Computational Methods in Fluid Power Jacek Stecki Main CFD Forum 0 November 10, 2002 06:49
My Revised "Time Vs Energy" Article For Review Abhi Main CFD Forum 2 July 9, 2002 10:08
Fluid flow in porous media question Orlando FLUENT 2 September 12, 2001 11:31


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 08:46.